bt switching off land line for digital voice

[Nittyg]

am i right in thinking with land lines soon to be switched off for digital voice calls, does that mean land line/rental charges will be lowered/reduced because of this or is that wishful thinking ?

[Jayach]

@Nittyg 

@Nittyg 

What you are referring to is the switch off of the PSTN (public switched telephone network) at the end of 2025 (and being phased in earlier in some place)

However it doesn't appear to apply to Now, as in many (most?) cases Now use Sky's own telephone network.

Going forward, some ISP's will supply a telephone service, some won't and for some it will be optional.

Prices (as always) will vary, so do a comparison at the time.

In the short term, nothing will change with Now. Long term, who knows? Without providing FTTP, they really have no future.

[chilli2]

As above, Sky and its offshoot, Now use their own equipment in the exchanges, the wires that go between your property and the exchange are owned and run by Openreach.

BT group have two offshoots, one is BT retail, and the other is called Openreach.

 Openreach is ( in theory) kept seperate to the retail divsion and other companys can use openreach wires and equipment to run their services over , BT retail is a customer of Openrthey are known as Leach. Where companies have tiehr own exchange equipment they are known as LLU providers - local loop unbundled as the wires that go from/to the exchange ( the loop) is unbundled ( removed) from the openreach equipment at the exchange

When you see news stories about phones being switched to digital voice theis usually means BT retail as the press doesnt understand the difference between openreach and the retail divsion , instead this just leads to more confusion as people think that this means for everyone.

If you are with Now then you dont need to worry about digital voice or whatever if you are happy with things as they are then thats it, eventually it will happen to everyone as the econmics of the systems used to run the full fibre network work out cheaper than having systems in place to run the copper network  you may also find that in some areas  even LLU providers will stop providing connections for new customers on the copper network.

 The keyword being new, if you are an existing customer then carry on as before

[RoyB]

@chilli2 @Jayach 

One of the (many!) things I don’t understand about all this is that, as I understand it, telephone needs a copper line back to the exchange from the cabinet, even with FTTC, for anything other than SOGEA.

So are Openreach still running copper from cabinet to exchange for new Now FTTC customers, to join up with the Sky/Now LLU equipment?

Even in Copper Stop Sell areas? Or do these become areas that Now can no longer supply? Or what?

[Jayach]

@RoyB 

---

@RoyB wrote:

@chilli2 @Jayach 

One of the (many!) things I don’t understand about all this is that, as I understand it, telephone needs a copper line back to the exchange from the cabinet, even with FTTC, for anything other than SOGEA.

---

Analogue telephony needs a copper line back to the exchange, be it using the PSTN (no new connections to which are being allowed) or the ISP's own version (which, I believe, is how Now can still be making new connections)

Of course digital telephony (VoIP) will use whatever broadband connection is available FTTC or FTTP.

Some copper connections will still be available even after the PSTN switch off in 2025. I believe 2027 is expected to be the date for the final copper to be retired.

[redchiz1]

Surely the fact is that when Openreach finally "retire" the old network that will be it for all copper lines, LLU or not? 

@RoyB I don't believe new NOW services are available in any stop sell areas. 

[RoyB]

@redchiz1 

Yes, the position when this is all finished is very clear; the whole country will be 100% fibre.

It’s the interim, the transition period, that is confusing. Stop Sell seems to kick in when the customer can have fibre to the cabinet, preventing him from choosing not to, but if the customer can’t have any fibre, even a new connection will be ADSL over copper to the exchange, via the cabinet.

And where a customer can’t have FTTP, they will still be connected via copper to the cabinet.

But SOGEA means there will be no more copper to the exchange to allow for PSTN phones, as there has been up until recently with FTTC.

So how does LLU help here, to allow new Now customers on FTTC not to be forced to go to VoIP? Mandating SOGEA doesn’t apply, so their lines still have copper from cabinet to exchange, to support PSTN, which is OK because LLU then handles it?

Which doesn’t sound like it would meet Openreach’s objectives…

Or have I got one or more of my assumptions wrong here?

[Jayach]

@RoyB 

@RoyB 

---

@RoyB wrote:
But SOGEA means there will be no more copper to the exchange to allow for PSTN phones, as there has been up until recently with FTTC.

SOGEA is only available over copper/FTTC,

From SOGEA - What Is It? | Check SOGEA Availability In Your Area (globe2.net)

"SOGEA uses a mix of fibre optic cables and copper wiring to deliver broadband to your premises. SOGEA is not full-fibre and so can only deliver download speeds of up to 80Mbps."

[RoyB]

@Jayach 

It’s confusing. A number of potential suppliers are contrasting SOGEA and FTTC, while others say SOGEA connects to FTTC. I suppose it depends on whether they class the copper PSTN line from cabinet to exchange for each customer as part of FTTC (as it was until the recent changes, before which you had only ADSL, copper all the way, or FTTP, no copper at all, to contrast it with) or separate from it.

I think you can argue either way, but it’s confusing that some suppliers make that distinction and others not.

So SOGEA is FTTC (copper from subscriber to the cabinet, fibre from there to the exchange and beyond), but uncoupled from the copper from cabinet to exchange that was always needed before, for the PSTN previously inseparable from FTTC broadband provision.

So, my query rephrased; a new subscriber takes a Now FTTC connection. (S)he gets to keep a PSTN line, by dint of Sky/Now having LLU equipment in the exchange. How does that work?

[Jayach]

@RoyB 

---

@RoyB wrote:
So, my query rephrased; a new subscriber takes a Now FTTC connection. (S)he gets to keep a PSTN line, by dint of Sky/Now having LLU equipment in the exchange. How does that work?

---

No.(S)he gets a POTS (Plain Old Telephone Service) line with the same technology as PSTN, but supplied by the Sky LLU equipment in the exchange.

PSTN is a BT/Openreach product/service. (not sure exactly what bit of BT owns it)

The abbreviations POTS and PTSN have often been used interchangeably, but there is a difference.

At least, that is how I understand it.