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Routermate
Advocate

Questions about upgrading to VDSL

I would like to upgrade my broadband to fibre, but I have a few questions first:

1) I am on Brilliant Broadband, and would like to upgrade to Fab Fibre. I can however not see a price per month for this. Does anyone know how much it is in total per month?

2) If I upgrade, do I get a new modem?

3) What is my contract length if I upgrade to Fab Fibre? How long am I tied to the contract before I can cancel? What are the charges for cancellation?

4) What are the minimum guaranteed upload and download speeds on Fab Fibre?

5) I am using my own modem and would like to completely replace any standard hardware from NowTV. Will NowTV be able to provide me with the username and password that the modem needs in order to authenticate with NowTV as ISP. This is important for me as I have modem hardware that is much more versatile than the factory hardware.

From my last thread here: https://community.nowtv.com/t5/Setup-Performance/TP-Link-modem-working-on-ADSL-dont-have-VDSL/m-p/58... I tried everything and there seems to be no work around using own modems on ADSL.

 

16 Replies
Jayach
Expert

On your previous thread you didn't say if you got it working. I presume you did as you say you are using your own modem. Just how did you achieve it?  

Routermate
Advocate

Never made it work. No settings seem to be working that I set. Right now the new router works as a bridged device and the factory modem is still plugged in.

Jayach
Expert

So you have an R8000? Nighthawk X6 R8000 | AC3200 Tri Band Router | NETGEAR Support

You say it is bridged, but to what? The Now router or the BT modem?

Sorry to answer your questions with more questions, but to get the answers right I want to understand where you are now.

It's been a very long time since any BT modems were installed (by BT) most ISP Hubs have had built-in modems for ages.

Routermate
Advocate

I have this: TP-Link VR400

 

It is simply connected to the NowTV factory modem, and works as the router. I have turned off wifi on the NowTV modem. I connected the TP router via WAN to the NowTV mode.

RoyB
Legend

1, 3, 4. https://www.nowtv.com/broadband?DCMP=KNC-BrandEE&ds_ag=Now+-+Broadband+-+Fibre+-+New+-+Broad&ds_kwid...

2. There is only one Now router, and as this will be an upgrade, you probably won’t get a second one.

5. You are aware this is still FTTC, which you are probably already on though the protocol is different, and not FTTP?

Signature:-
Please do not say ‘you’ in your posting and imagine you are talking to any employees of Now. Generally, we are all customers like yourself, who can’t help with billing or other queries that only Now can answer 😞
Routermate
Advocate

Regarding 5, what does that imply?

Jayach
Expert

I think @RoyB is implying that you can't use the R8000 directly on FTTC, only on FTTP. You start your thread by saying "I would like to upgrade my broadband to fibre", but Now is not fibre (FTTP) it is FTTC (hybrid fibre or Fibre to the Cabinet)

That's why you will need a modem to use the R8000.

I'm sure @RoyB will let us know if I have misunderstood his meaning.

Jayach
Expert


@RoyB wrote:

5. You are aware this is still FTTC, which you are probably already on though the protocol is different, and not FTTP?


No the OP is on Brilliant Broadband, which is ADSL, no fibre involved. (lets not go through that again) https://community.nowtv.com/t5/Setup-Performance/FTTP/m-p/581768

 

RoyB
Legend

@Jayach 

So are we saying that when OpenReach fibred up the cabinets, they left all the old copper in place on the off chance that somebody wants to drop back to Brilliant Broadband?

So what, physically, happens when you go from Brilliant Broadband to Fab Fibre?

The POTS line back to the exchange remains in place and they run more copper from the cabinet to your home? Or OpenReach unhook your copper from cabinet to exchange in the cabinet, and hook you up to fibre to the exchange?

So there must be a lot of copper that OpenReach can reclaim when an area goes Stop Copper? Or they can’t, because there are always a few ADSL, or no broadband at all, holdouts?

Ive had a little poke about on the web, and there are plenty of descriptions of ADSL versus VDSL, FTTC versus FTTP, but found nothing about the physical reality of the swapovers.

I guess when we went FTTP at our previous house, the copper for the FTTC stayed in the ground; and where we are now there is no copper laid at all, and the whole new-build estate is FTTP; which is why there are now FTTP tariffs comparable with the older services, for people who don’t want hundreds of Mbps.

But I’m really surprised that OpenReach haven’t come up with any technical solution to run everyone on a cabinet back to the exchange over fibre.

Signature:-
Please do not say ‘you’ in your posting and imagine you are talking to any employees of Now. Generally, we are all customers like yourself, who can’t help with billing or other queries that only Now can answer 😞
Jayach
Expert

@RoyB 

First I must say I have never worked in the telecoms industry, always in computers alongside it. So there is a little conjecture in my understanding.

You're completely overthinking where we are now, without considering how we got here.
Originally, when we all had rotary dials and were hard wired into the sockets on the wall there were big bundles of paired copper wires running from the exchange to a box in the street.

From our homes there was a pair of copper wires running to the same cabinet. In that cabinet the BT (or Post Office then) would cross connect from one to the other to give us a connection. Useful video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyxakVAPcuQ


Then we started to use dial up modems to connect to various computer systems. (no internet yet, you had to connect directly to the system you wanted to deal with)
This was expensive (you were paying by the minute to connect) and the rest of the family couldn't use the phone to talk to Auntie Joan because the line was tied up. (obviously no one could call you either for the same reason, no mobiles back then)


So someone came up with the idea of an always on data connection. This was achieved by having equipment in the exchange that would use frequencies that could be used on that copper pair, that were outside those needed for speech, to carry data encoded in them. That was basically ADSL (Asymmetric digital subscriber line) As far as I know, all that is still in place.


But we started to want to pump more data up and down those lines than could be carried over a (very) long pair of copper wires. By now Fibre was available and the obvious choice to achieve that. But it was not practical to replace all the copper from the exchange to the homes/premises. So they decided just to replace part of the run for those people willing to pay a premium. Alongside the copper bundle from the exchange they ran a fibre bundle (not necessarily physically alongside, it may take a different route) to another cabinet placed close to the first. In this cabinet was installed all the equipment required to convert the fibre data to electrical, along with power, batteries and fans (that's why you can hear them whirring) to ensure it would keep working in case of a power cut.


So when someone decided they wanted "fibre" broadband they could order it, a link would be made from their connection in the original box to the new fibre box and the corresponding change made in the exchange. The original full copper connection back to the exchange was still in place, POTS (Plain old telephone service) was using it. This is VDSL (Very high-speed digital subscriber line) or FTTP (Fibre to the Cabinet)
So all the ADSL equipment is still in place and running alongside the VDSL. If someone wanted to go back to ADSL from VDSL, would that mean being put back on full copper? I think yes, but I can't be sure.


Once all the phone lines are digital they can rip out all those long copper bundles back to the exchange, so ADSL will not longer be a possibility.

If there are any errors in my description. I'm sure someone will point it out.

Jayach
Expert


@RoyB wrote:

But I’m really surprised that OpenReach haven’t come up with any technical solution to run everyone on a cabinet back to the exchange over fibre.


They have, we are living it now. It called the full fibre roll out.

Edit:

Darn,  this was supposed to come after the next reply.

Jayach
Expert

Oops rereading this, that was not what you asked. I think the problem was that the fibre cabinets become full (that's when people say they can't order it, but their neighbour already has it). They could add another cabinet, but then there may only be a few people using it and that becomes expensive) Going back in time again, when they started FTTP/VDSL they had no guarantee how many people would use it.

I  think it came down to cost/capacity. And it has now been overtaken by the Full Fibre Roll Out.

RoyB
Legend

Error - please ignore

Signature:-
Please do not say ‘you’ in your posting and imagine you are talking to any employees of Now. Generally, we are all customers like yourself, who can’t help with billing or other queries that only Now can answer 😞
chilli2
Expert 2

If you want to use a non now router, you are usually better off going to the specific router manufacturers own support pages , ie tp link, asus, d link etc.

 Some people will be happy to share experiences with other routers on here, and i can only speak for my own set up, but will sometimes try and point people towards a relevant site.

 

AS for Now, VDSL, like ADSL is a copper based product and not what is now being called full fibre

PDM
Mentor

I changed from Brilliant broadband to Super Fibre about 5 months ago. The change was carried out by phone as I wanted to ask similar questions. Super Fibre was the same price as Fab Fibre. A new 12 month contract was initiated. I was part way through my Brilliant broadband contract and there was no cancellation fee for the upgrade. The change went smoothly. No new router was needed or provided. Now are offering both Fab Fibre and Super Fibre for the same price which at the moment is £20 however neither include anytime calls. My guaranteed download speed was 32.4 Mbps but as you will be aware, this depends on distance from the cabinet. I'm getting 46 - 48 Mbps download and 7-8 Mbps upload.

Jayach
Expert

@PDM 

Thanks for your reply, as you have gone through the exact procedure the OP is considering, your answers will be most helpful.