Latest update removing dev mode

[Anonymous User]

Originally by JaBuzzard: (Post 1 page 49)

SeeMoreDigital wrote:
What???

A NOW TV branded box retails at just £15. 00. The Roku boxes cost signi��cantly more! Somebodies
taking a hit for the differences!

Yes Roku are not making a pro��t. There is a large difference between zero pro��t and a subsidy. The bill
of materials for a NowTV box is most likely well under £15, and my bet is most of the NowTV boxes sold
are not the £15 ones either , because wait a bit and you can get one with a pass for the same amount of
money or even less, to the point where people who never sideloaded anything have draw fulls of the
boxes, because even an offer of £20 for a box with a 3 month entertainment pass (and there have been
lots of better offers) is cheaper than buying three months of passes which would cost you £21 and you
get a spare remote too.

Originally by Wufflebonk: (Post 2 Page 49)

jabuzzard wrote:
SeeMoreDigital wrote:
What???

A NOW TV branded box retails at just £15. 00. The Roku boxes cost signi��cantly more!
Somebodies taking a hit for the differences!

Yes Roku are not making a pro��t. There is a large difference between zero pro��t and a subsidy. The
bill of materials for a NowTV box is most likely well under £15, and my bet is most of the NowTV
boxes sold are not the £15 ones either , because wait a bit and you can get one with a pass for the
same amount of money or even less, to the point where people who never sideloaded anything
have draw fulls of the boxes, because even an offer of £20 for a box with a 3 month entertainment
pass (and there have been lots of better offers) is cheaper than buying three months of passes
which would cost you £21 and you get a spare remote too.

I'll let you carry on with this one 🙂

I'm busy doing other things....

Besides I see @SeeMoreDigital and co have gotten out the vinyl's again... damn they must be so
scratched and broken now the amount of times they've been played. I think Violins are probably all but
worn out too...

Originally by ukbobboy:

@SeeMoreDigital

Hi again SMD

Unfortunately, your answer shows that you have made an assumption based on another assumption,
i.e. if a Roku 3 retail cost £70. 00 and a NowTV black box is £15. 00 then someone is loosing out
somewhere.

However , my experience is somewhat different, remember when video VHS recorder , way back when,
cost on average £400. 00 retail. Did you know that they only cost £71. 00 to manufacture, package and
ship from Japan to the UK, the additional costs were mainly just "mark-up", i.e. what the market will
bear .

Since retail economics has not changed since then, just the products sold, I would suggest you rethink
your "highly subsidised" mantra, unless you can prove otherwise.


UK Bob

Originally by 4268:

@ukbobboy have you considered that there is such a thing as a loss leader .

Originally by Eddie-M (NowTV Team):

Hi @Anonymous User


Thanks for raising your concerns to us here on the Community, In relation to what a Now TV agent has
said about Plex being illegal your correct it is not however the content available to use with in Plex and
other Apps like it can be seen as illegal and therefore puts Now TV in a difficult position with Studios
and Record companies and therefore the decision was made to remove the Dev Mode which enabled
the ability to install Plex via Sideloading due to Plex not being available in the Now TV app store. Also if
apps are being used via the Now T v box that are not available in the App store provided and are
installed by other means i.e Sideloading then Now TV have the right to remove that functionallity if we
wish to do so. If your complaint relates to official apps in the app store available via the Now TV box
then please do raise those concerns with us and we will do what we can can to rectify them. However if
it only relates to an app not offically available on the Now TV box then we cannot do anything further
and there would be no legal basis for us to put that function back as it is against our terms of use. I
hope this clears it up for you and if you have any further questions please do ask away and we will do
our best to answer or at least get the answer for you.


Thanks
Eddie

Originally by DessieB:

Hi Eddie,

I wonder if you could take a moment to explain how customers using Plex on a NOW TV box puts Now
TV in a difficult position with Studios and Record companies, but Apple TV, Amazon Fire TV and Roku
all provide Plex for their Streaming boxes and Google provide Plex for android TV boxes without this
putting them in a difficult position with Studios and Record companies?

Thanks
DessieB

Originally by Eddie-M (Official NowTV Team)

Hi @Anonymous User

This would come down to legal notices Now TV have received and therefore have had to remove the
fuction due to some Customers using Plex to watch Pirated Content. So the Dev Mode has been
disabled to prevent Pirated content in the future which in turn has disabled Plex which again can be
used to access Content which can be seen as illegal. This is the steps we found nessecerry to take to
prevent this from happening. If others have not done this then we cannot speak for them we feel this
was the best step to take.


Cheers

Originally by DessieB

Hi Eddie,

So are you suggesting that Apple, Amazon, Roku and Google have not received similar legal notices, or
that they have received similar notices but have chosen to ignore them?

DessieB

Originally by Eddie-M (Official NowTV Team):

No at all @Anonymous User


I'm not suggesting anything of the sort. I am telling you what Now TV have received and what we have
done to rectify it if other companies have recieved the same notices then i'm sure they are taking the
Steps nessecerry to rectify that however we at Now TV are not privy to that information and therefore
cannot discuss what other companies intend to do if anything or if they have recieved the same
notices we can only discuss what Now TV have recieved and what we have done to ��x it. At the end of
the day Plex is not an offical app in the App store via the Now TV box therefore Now TV have no
legal obligation to provide that app and therefore can remove any means of accessing it.


Cheers

Originally by MattPenfold:

Eddie-M wrote:
Hi @Anonymous User


Thanks for raising your concerns to us here on the Community, In relation to what a Now TV agent
has said about Plex being illegal your correct it is not however the content available to use with in
Plex and other Apps like it can be seen as illegal and therefore puts Now TV in a difficult position
with Studios and Record companies and therefore the decision was made to remove the Dev Mode
which enabled the ability to install Plex via Sideloading due to Plex not being available in the Now
TV app store. Also if apps are being used via the Now T v box that are not available in the App store
provided and are installed by other means i.e Sideloading then Now TV have the right to remove
that functionallity if we wish to do so. If your complaint relates to official apps in the app store
available via the Now TV box then please do raise those concerns with us and we will do what we
can can to rectify them. However if it only relates to an app not offically available on the Now TV box
then we cannot do anything further and there would be no legal basis for us to put that function
back as it is against our terms of use. I hope this clears it up for you and if you have any further
questions please do ask away and we will do our best to answer or at least get the answer for you.


Thanks
Eddie
So why was I told Plex is illegal Eddie? You admit is untrue, yet that did not stop your colleagues from
say Plex is illegal software. What do you intend to do about their lack of honesty?

You claim you have the right to remove side-loaded apps, but you failed to offer any evidence you have
that right. Since you offered no evidence I can dismiss your claim you have that rigjt as baseless. You
have a choice. You can either offer that evidence, or accept you lied to me.

Originally by MattPenfold: (Post 1 on page 50)

Eddie,
You have admitted that Not TV altered my box. The law, in the form of the Computer Misuse Act 1990 is
clear in this regard. Unless you can show Now TV were authorized to access my box and make
alterations NOW TV have committed a criminal offence under Section 35 of that act. It is possible that
Now TV could be considered to have committed an offence under Section 37 , if there was intend to
impair use of the computer . A Section 35 offence carries a maximum sentence of 2 years
imprisonment, and a Section 37 offence carries a maximum of 10 years. Both offences can also carry
an unlimited Ƭne.
So you can only claim that Now TV have not comitted an offence under either Section 35 or 37 if you
can show you had authorisation to access my Now TV box. If you cannot do so, you will be admitting
that NOW TV commited a criminal offence.

Originally by WuffleBonk: (Post 2 on page 50)

@Anonymous User from NowTV, I think there's an age old addidge here that relates to Digging holes and knowing
when to stop 😄

From what I can see, your just not doing ANYTHING to help here, except making up what looks like
semi plausible explanations and hoping that we'll all buy into it.

I have to tip my hat and give you points for trying though. As myself and my co-conspiritors have
recently discovered, we can actually use the official, authourized apps that ARE in the NowTV store,
and pre installed on the box, INCLUDING YOUR VERY OWN NOWTV APP , to play ANY CONTENT we
want, including pirated content should we so wish, I wonder what the recording industry and
music/movie producers that sent NowTV those cease and desist plex letters would do if they found out
about that fact???

I think you'd be forced to remove your own apps, and every official app from the box, IF what your
trying to spin to us all, is actually true....

[Anonymous User]

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@SeeMoreDigital wrote:

All of you (both of you). Read NOW TV's terms and conditions. ie: the ones you accepted before activating your NOW TV branded box!

---

What you mena the ones that state where not allowed to alter, reverse engineer or attempt to in anyway change the software that NowTV burn into the firmware, but allows us to do what ever the hell we like with the hardware that we now own once we've bought it.

and since we own the hardware, that very clause in NowTV's own Ts&Cs basicialy makes it illegal for them to alter the hardware without the owners express permission to do so.

They ARE permitted to change the software, as they retain ownership of that software, and as long as that software runns on the box, the Ts&Cs expressly give them permission to change that software, but ONLY if that change does not cause previous function of the hardware that the owner relied on to be changed.

[Anonymous User]

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@Anonymous User wrote:

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@SeeMoreDigital wrote:

All of you (both of you). Read NOW TV's terms and conditions. ie: the ones you accepted before activating your NOW TV branded box!

---

What you mena the ones that state where not allowed to alter, reverse engineer or attempt to in anyway change the software that NowTV burn into the firmware, but allows us to do what ever the hell we like with the hardware that we now own once we've bought it.

---

Those conditions are null and void still in the EU. That is reverse engineering is legal everywhere for the purpose of interoperability in the EU and as we have not currently left it is still in force. I refer you to directive 2009/24/EC and it's predecessor 91/250/EEC.

Sky/NowTV/Roku can put whatever rubbish they like in their terms and conditions, but in the UK you can't sign away your legal rights quite as easily as in other coutries such as the USA. It is why a lot of "licenses" in IT which originate in the USA are utter junk by the time they get to this side of the Atlantic. I would note that Roku are a USA company so their terms and conditions need to be taken with a bucket full of salt.

[Anonymous User]

Haha, i wonded how long it would take you to delete my post 😛

It adds to my point though after the deletion of the old thread. This is no longer a "Community board" at all, but actually a board managed by a group of people who think NowTV is gods gift and can do no wrong. Those of whom will delete or censor anything they don't like or anything that may place a negative point of view against NowTV, even if such posters are expressing there honest view or experiance with the service.

That been said, the great thing about the internet is that once something is posted public it remians public. Just becuase you have magical powers to make things disappear on here, doesnt mean it's gone.

Sideloading Plex or any other app was not against the terms. It was exisitng and valid functionality that existed within the software on the box, you were not altering the firware but simply making use of it. It is no differance to using any of the other features within the software and if NowTV did not want such functionallity to be used then they could of removed it at anytime (which of course they now have done so). You can quote terms as much as you like, nobody was in breach of them for sideloading. Also just becuase you have a set of terms to quote doesn't make them legally bound.. most big compaines have a mass of "small print" or "terms". The majority of it has no legal bound but they rely on the fact that most people do not know that. NowTV's terms are a good example of this, at least half of it have no legal bound.

[Anonymous User]

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@Anonymous User wrote:

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You do know that your interfearing with the right to free speech here, and by doing what theyv'e done, NowTV are in effect censoring mine and everyone elses right to free speech on this forum.

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The right to free speech is the right to speak without interference from the goverment. There is NOTHING that Sky can EVER do that will infringe your right to free speech. Unfortunately most of the general public don't understand that and assume that the private corporations can infringe your right to free speech, which of course they cannot.

[Anonymous User]

It's not your property anymore, so we will do what we want and we will help anybody to be happy. Good luck

[Anonymous User]

I have been looking on the Now TV website for their address. In the UK it is a requirment that companies provide their registered address on their website. 

Now it is possible it is just hidden away, so if it is could someone point me towards it please. 

[Anonymous User]

So they can't do nothing to us if we hack them products. We paid for and is our property. They should give us money back 

[Anonymous User]

Another thought: Can the brainy nerds not be able to completely flash this box with a proper Android TV box software?

The box can then become useful for streaming & casting  via IPTV.

Thanks for further inputs.

[Anonymous User]

Very good, and i think they don't have rights to bring us to court. We paid for that and it's our property now. So we are not braking the law if we do anything about now tv box or stick. We didn't sign any contract with them, they can give us money back or we will find the way to bring developer mode back. 

[Anonymous User]

I am trying to get into developer mode using the Home,Home,Home,Up,Up,right,left,right,left,right through the remote but is not working. Can anybody advise how this is done now