cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
JUDGEJONES36
Contributor 1

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

I've found an 8gb micro sd card and formatted it but not sure how to move the apps to the card...
Can you help please???Kind regards to you Paul
0 Thanks
Reply
PaulNormanUK
Contributor 1

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

You don't do anything. After successfully formatting the sd card, a message pops up saying something along the lines of please wait while we transfer your apps, it does it automatically.

FYI, I used a "class 4" 8GB sd card, "class 4" 16GB sd card and a "class 10 Ultra" 32GB sd card and all three work with the v2 smart tv box. The 4GB sd card I used was an old sd card with no class markings on it. I have some 64GB cards laying around and I will try one in the v2 smart box when I get time.

I have the old v1 smart box laying in a box somewhere and I can test the memory cards on that too if anyone is interested?

0 Thanks
Reply
zulubianco
Occasional Poster

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

Hi UK Bob

 

First of all, thanks for the thanks the other day. I notice that you've been on this subject for a good year or so. A big-up also needs to go out to NewbieJW just before my post. He got his working with a 2GB card. I have a SKY, NOT ROKU, 4200SK V002 Box. I had tried a 16GB and 8GB without success. But I did have my old 4GB, 2GB, 1GB and 256MB (yup, got a couple of those, maybe even a 32MB one somewhere) cards at the ready. I HAD expected the 16GB to work - to me, this IS a TINY capacity these days! I didn't expect to go SMALLER. Obviously, size does matter in certain situations. I consider 128GB too small too - nowadays I'm using 400GB microSDs in my devices. So, I thought, before I go any further, let me do a bit of research. If I hadn't, then I most likely wouldn't have posted my own eventual success... and you'd all still be on hold at ROKU support. I came across NewbieJW's post kinda by accident, and, as soon as I saw the 2 part of the 2GB, I got it straight away! It wasn't a card or slot or whatever problem - it was a size problem. But not really a size problem - but most likely a 'bus' width problem i.e. 8-bit bus, 16-bit, 32-bit etc. I've had this before with computers where only half or one side of the memory module would be seen... or none. NewbieJW, AND others reading his post, I believe, didn't realise the importance of the size since he just stuck in a spare card lying around, which just happened to be 2GB, and it worked. So, when everyone else stuck in their SPARE OLD card which was 8GB and above, and it didn't work, they assumed something was faulty... like the technical 'experts' you tried thrice did (I come across these experts all the time - try asking some phone shop techies what USB OTG is... none, so far, have heard of it). Doh! Or, everyone thought the port was disabled. It possibly never has been disabled. I've got to say, since I posted, this has all been quite funny... it's had ME laughing. It certainly got Paul Norman on the case lol. Hi Paul, I'm male, btw - well, I was the last time I checked... but with all of these microwaves from these boxes flying around, anything could happen by lunchtime ha ha... especially when we get 5G... then we'll all be getting cooked... read up on 5G health/life risks. So, I can see that Paul has picked up the gauntlet and been digging the antiques out and testing them in various boxes. A true enthusiast, and he has jointly found a worthwhile cause for all of the tech-junk we've all got lying around. Hopefully it brightened his week. By the end of the month, this forum topic should be 100 pages long and have cracked every single box model vs memory card size AND  a kind individual will have produced a comprehensive XY Grid Chart. The thing I'm worried about, apart from 5G, now, is creating a worldwide shortage of Antique Class 2 4GB and less cards... plus I can see CEX banging the price up from about 20p to £20 ha ha. Sshhh... don't tell anyone. And the council recycling centre workers will be skip-diving down at the bottom of the electrical skip - I can just imagine 6 pairs of boots sticking out of pile lol. Then there's the eBayers who know a good opportunity when they see it, digging those boxes of unsold stock of 2GB cards from 2005 out of the attic. Roku, on Wikipedia, list the Roku 4200 as ONLY having 512MB of 'memory' and ONLY 256MB of 'channel storage' which is ridiculously low on either account. Most of them are low on memory and storage, with the better ones still only being mostly 1GB/512MB. It has a dual core 900MHz Cortex A9 CPU (reasonable, I guess). I also found out that the OS is Roku OS based on Unix. And, by the way it loads the apps, it's possibly using a JIT (Just In Time) Compiler. And I think that the reason for the SD card capacity limit being small is because it's using the card as MEMORY/RAM, not file storage, which fits in with what I was saying earlier about addressing memory modules. In the other models that can take 32GB, maybe it's partitioning the card and doing both jobs. I don't know for sure. They COULD have simply told us in a technical specification section of a manual couldn't they. And, finally, here's a teardown somebody did of the 4200:

 

http://www.mycablealternatives.com/2015/06/roku-3-4200x-teardown/ b

 

and here's another spec page that I have found:

 

https://wikidevi.com/wiki/Roku_3_(4200X)

 

Let the mission continue ... (^_-) 

0 Thanks
Reply
Highlighted
PaulNormanUK
Contributor 1

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

I agree with you when you say that the sd card is probably being used for RAM/MEMORY rather than file storage. I place a cheap 16GB class 4 SD card in each of my boxes and don't see the need for anything more in these boxes... I am wondering if live pause on the Smart Boxes increases from the maximum of 30 minutes when using a SD card though.  

0 Thanks
Reply
ukbobboy
Expert 2

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

@PaulNormanUK  @zulubianco 

Hi Guys

I just want to throw a contrary view into the mix, both of you said, "...the sd card is probably being used for RAM/MEMORY rather than file storage."  But please bear in mind that this is just my view.

First, when I installed my 2GB SD card into my Roku 3, it was formatted down to 1.9GB of usable memory.  As far as I remember, you do not format RAM memory but you do storage memory.

Second, I have 53 apps/channels on my Roku 3, my system then reported that 8% of my 1.9GB storage is being used.  There would be no reason to report this figure if it was purely variable RAM usage, but a solid 8% usage of my available storage is something else.

Therefore, while it is possible the SD card could be used as a RAM card, I get the distinct feeling it is used to store some parts of the Rukos/Now TV boxes apps/channels.

Until next time.

 

UK BobHappy Music Emoji 2.jpg

PS. Listening to some cool music while sipping on a smirnoff and cola.

 

zulubianco
Occasional Poster

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

Oh dear... now it's getting complicated, and, no doubt, is going to get controversial. Whoops!

First, I'm no programmer nor electronic engineer, but I understand how these work from lots kf computer experience 

0 Thanks
Reply
JUDGEJONES36
Contributor 1

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

Oh I had a giggle or two on your reply bud....I've got yo say I've put an old 8gb I had lying around too and seem to be quicker on loading the programmes on the box. But one little issue, (well at the moment anyway) is every time I turn on the Tom I box it's asking me if I want to format the card.???? I hope it's not going to cheese me off that much that it will make me pull the blinking thing out.....Anyway overall happy with the speed again now. Thanks to you guys.😉😊😀🤗👍👌🤛🤛🤛
0 Thanks
Reply
zulubianco
Occasional Poster

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

Sorry everyone, I keep messing these posts up. The input fields are iffy - I tap on them to move the cursor and everything jumps around and posts by Accident. Where are these web programmers... I need something fixing.

 

Oh dear... now it's getting complicated, and, no doubt, is going to get controversial. Whoops!

 

First, I'm no programmer nor electronic engineer, but I understand how a lot of things work by applying cause and effect and MY 😉 universal equation 'structure=function' or 'function=structure'. And I have lots of computer experience going back to MS-DOS 3.0 and 5 1/4 disks etc. In terms of this, EVERYTHING is a machine i.e. EVERYTHING, including software, is hardware. Also, there's no fundamental difference between random access memory or storage memory except speed. They are BOTH physical forms of memory/storage. Basically, as I describe it to people, there's nothing new in the universe e.g. solid state, rather than circular disk (or record player) memory, is nothing more than a fast 2D/3D abacus (memory 'sticks' have a Row Address and a Column Address... you may have seen the acronym RAS/CAS). Floppy disk drives, hard disk drives, mini disk drives, cd-rom/ram drives, dvd drives are ALL just 'records' and 'needles'. Even the abacus is a 'record' and 'needle' technology - just rectangular or cuboid instead, with one's finger being the needle. And they're all using blocks of material to encode or format code. Different designs and materials i.e. structures produce different efficiencies or speeds. Structure is synonymous with format. Faster memory is used for RAM i.e. Random Access to speed up continuous access and multitasking, whereas slower storage memory is usually used for a single or the first access when the code is copied from this slow usually sequential access into the fast random access hardware. So, simply put, EVERYTHING by way of being a structure is already formatted, including RAM which IS a physical object. People seem to forget that RAM is physical, and think that it's meta-physical like human consciousness - as if it's some kind of non-physical ether or plasma or made of 'nothing'... but even human consciousness exists entirely in physical construct. So, of course, RAM needs 'formatting' and is formatted and is re-formattable. At boot-up, or at some point, parts of it are formatted in preparation for code from the disk drive by the BIOS and so on. There's a whole sequence of things that go one during boot up e. g. RAM is divided into memory addresses and so on - this is all formatting. It is possible to allocate part of RAM and create a RAM-Drive where it looks and acts like a drive with a drive-letter. Similarly, as on Windows, a Swapfile can be, and is, created on the hard drive, or SSD more often nowadays - a Swapfile being an area of the hard drive or SSD that is used as 'RAM' whereby Windows will swap less-needed RAM data to Swapfile rather than close the app down completely and have to reload it from scratch when it needed it again. In the old days when RAM was expensive, and Windows had run out of REAL RAM, the swapfile was used as 'fake' RAM. The weird thing is, because of the way Windows has been designed to work, it STILL creates, needs and uses a Swapfile even when you have loads of free RAM. The Swapfile can either be dynamic i.e. Windows will alter the size as it requires, or it can be set as a fixed size. Even if you set a 0MB Swapfile size to force Windows to use ONLY REAL RAM, Windows will STILL create and use part of the drive as a swapfile or tempfile or pseudo-RAM. Oh, and in Windows, you can also plug in an SD card or USB stick, and format that, if it tests as fast enough, as a RAM extension. Formatting doesn't just mean creating or preparing a disk drive. This explanation is all very simplified, and I've explained it probably a bit too much, but my aim was to 'prove' that it's all the same stuff and it all HAS to be 'formatted' in order to be able to use it. We haven't even got into CACHE-RAM or caching in general. Cache-RAM is usually faster still than 'ordinary' RAM. I don't know anything about Unix, which the Roku, Android, Linux etc use, but they're all using similar methods to speed things up. Generally, when one is talking about RAM, RAM is 'instant' access, and disk access is delayed. So, when LOADING an app on the Sky/Roku, without an SD card, you'll notice the percentage counter going up (slowly) as it loads the app from slow storage into RAM. When you change apps, the small amount of RAM is cleared because there's not enough available to load the second app... which then goes through the same percentage load process. When you change back again, the same thing happens again. But, if you put a 2GB card in, which is 4 times bigger than the 512MB for the 4200SK Box, for example, you've now got space for 4 apps at once in RAM. So, if you switch between just those 4 apps, they won't have to reload... they'll be there, 'instantly', multitasking/refreshing in the background like multiple apps on a smartphone. This is why I/we say that the microSD is acting as extra RAM. And the Box DOES format it, as you know, proving that RAM is formatted like anything else. Getting some longer 'rewind' time imo would also be a RAM function whereby this 'RAM-Card' is not only formatted but possibly partitioned to provide different areas for different instant-access functions. Based on these functions we deduct the likely structure of what the microSD is once formatted i.e. RAM. I could be wrong, and there WILL be some clever guy on the planet who knows what's going on exactly - especially the people who made these 'enigmatic' devices... who are nowhere to be found (so we'll keep in guessing). I did say previously that it could possibly be being partitioned as part RAM, part storage. The bottom line is... the microSD works 'like' RAM. If it looks like RAM, smells like RAM, tastes like RAM... then it MUST be RAM. And my brain is all RAMMED out right now... ha ha. One final point: it's not simply a case of 2GB being 4 times bigger than the onboard 512MB since some or most of that will be used up to load the Box's OS, menu, WiFi and Graphics drivers and so on - so there's possibly only about 100MB, if that, left for any app/channel launch... which explains why with a 2GB card, I've only used 7% after loading/using 2 channels since I installed the card. 2GB/2000MB is 20 times bigger than this assumed 100MB free, and 100MB is 5% of 2GB - so my 7%, close to 10%, for 2 cached apps fits into my maths assumptions of around 50-100MB needed for each cached app. I think we're on the right tracks. Don't worry Roku/Sky Support, we're figuring it out for ourselves... oh, btw, your redundancy cheques will be ready 9am Monday ;-?

 

ciaofornow everyone

0 Thanks
Reply
zulubianco
Occasional Poster

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

p. s. in Windows or your smartphone or your tablet, RAM IS reported in relevant sections as a percentage and/or value of total memory used, and is reported separate to file/app/disk storage. Remember, RAM IS PHYSICAL... so, it has capacity, too, like any other storage.

Also, another reason why I don't think the microSD is used strictly or wholly just as storage or for downloading apps is because you can still download the app without the card in. But you could be correct about it simply being for storage. This is why I mentioned the compiler being a JIT-type Compiler. Or maybe the Loader is a JIT-type Loader i.e. Just in Time. Android used to use this in earlier versions. When loading or installing an app, it would only load the main functional or bits, say 30%, which would be, say, the app's menu. This saves a lot of RAM, and where RAM was small, it allowed multiple apps to load i.e. multitask... or APPEAR to multitask i.e. it was swopping things around like with a Windows Swapfile. Then, ONLY when you selected a particular menu item, did it load that bit of the code i. e. if the code wasn't needed, it wasn't loaded i. e. based on the Just In Time principle/protocol. With the latest versions of android and those with large amounts of RAM, the WHOLE app code is now loaded into RAM at once... making the app quicker, obviously, because ALL the code is present in RAM. So, with Roku/Sky box, maybe the same JIT process is happening i.e. when we install an app without an SD card, only 10-30% of the app is 'installed' to basically give us the App's PICTURE in the library. Then, when we launch the app, it then downloads over wifi the other 70-90% of the app straight into RAM, then opens it, and we use it. If we close it, RAM is cleared... and then it's gone i.e. that 70-90% is no longer on the Box. Then, when we re-launch it, the Box has to download that 70-90% ALL OVER AGAIN. When we put a microSD card in, the first time we launch the app, it downloads the other 70-90% over WiFi and stores that on the card as storage, as you say, AND launches it immediately after that. Then, when we exit the app, RAM is cleared as normal BUT the WHOLE 100% of the APP is now still on the Box. So, when we relaunch a subsequent time, it doesn't need to re-download over WIFI but simply runs the app stored now on the SD card. This is highly probable too. Both scenarios are equally likely. But we don't know exactly. What we do know is that whichever method is being used, they both have the same functionality when we put an SD card in. Lets take a vote ;->

0 Thanks
Reply
JUDGEJONES36
Contributor 1

Re: Usb port and a micro sd slot in a smart box and a NOWTV box

😉😃👍👍👍👍
0 Thanks
Reply