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Anonymous User
Not applicable

Latest update removing dev mode

Originally by JaBuzzard: (Post 1 page 49)

 

SeeMoreDigital wrote:
What???

A NOW TV branded box retails at just £15. 00. The Roku boxes cost signi��cantly more! Somebodies
taking a hit for the differences!

Yes Roku are not making a pro��t. There is a large difference between zero pro��t and a subsidy. The bill
of materials for a NowTV box is most likely well under £15, and my bet is most of the NowTV boxes sold
are not the £15 ones either , because wait a bit and you can get one with a pass for the same amount of
money or even less, to the point where people who never sideloaded anything have draw fulls of the
boxes, because even an offer of £20 for a box with a 3 month entertainment pass (and there have been
lots of better offers) is cheaper than buying three months of passes which would cost you £21 and you
get a spare remote too.

 

Originally by Wufflebonk: (Post 2 Page 49)

 

jabuzzard wrote:
SeeMoreDigital wrote:
What???

A NOW TV branded box retails at just £15. 00. The Roku boxes cost signi��cantly more!
Somebodies taking a hit for the differences!

Yes Roku are not making a pro��t. There is a large difference between zero pro��t and a subsidy. The
bill of materials for a NowTV box is most likely well under £15, and my bet is most of the NowTV
boxes sold are not the £15 ones either , because wait a bit and you can get one with a pass for the
same amount of money or even less, to the point where people who never sideloaded anything
have draw fulls of the boxes, because even an offer of £20 for a box with a 3 month entertainment
pass (and there have been lots of better offers) is cheaper than buying three months of passes
which would cost you £21 and you get a spare remote too.

I'll let you carry on with this one 🙂

I'm busy doing other things....

Besides I see @SeeMoreDigital and co have gotten out the vinyl's again... damn they must be so
scratched and broken now the amount of times they've been played. I think Violins are probably all but
worn out too...

 

Originally by ukbobboy:

 

@SeeMoreDigital

Hi again SMD

Unfortunately, your answer shows that you have made an assumption based on another assumption,
i.e. if a Roku 3 retail cost £70. 00 and a NowTV black box is £15. 00 then someone is loosing out
somewhere.

However , my experience is somewhat different, remember when video VHS recorder , way back when,
cost on average £400. 00 retail. Did you know that they only cost £71. 00 to manufacture, package and
ship from Japan to the UK, the additional costs were mainly just "mark-up", i.e. what the market will
bear .

Since retail economics has not changed since then, just the products sold, I would suggest you rethink
your "highly subsidised" mantra, unless you can prove otherwise.


UK Bob

 

Originally by 4268:

 

@ukbobboy have you considered that there is such a thing as a loss leader .

 

Originally by Eddie-M (NowTV Team):

 

Hi @Anonymous User


Thanks for raising your concerns to us here on the Community, In relation to what a Now TV agent has
said about Plex being illegal your correct it is not however the content available to use with in Plex and
other Apps like it can be seen as illegal and therefore puts Now TV in a difficult position with Studios
and Record companies and therefore the decision was made to remove the Dev Mode which enabled
the ability to install Plex via Sideloading due to Plex not being available in the Now TV app store. Also if
apps are being used via the Now T v box that are not available in the App store provided and are
installed by other means i.e Sideloading then Now TV have the right to remove that functionallity if we
wish to do so. If your complaint relates to official apps in the app store available via the Now TV box
then please do raise those concerns with us and we will do what we can can to rectify them. However if
it only relates to an app not offically available on the Now TV box then we cannot do anything further
and there would be no legal basis for us to put that function back as it is against our terms of use. I
hope this clears it up for you and if you have any further questions please do ask away and we will do
our best to answer or at least get the answer for you.


Thanks
Eddie

 

Originally by DessieB:

 

Hi Eddie,

I wonder if you could take a moment to explain how customers using Plex on a NOW TV box puts Now
TV in a difficult position with Studios and Record companies, but Apple TV, Amazon Fire TV and Roku
all provide Plex for their Streaming boxes and Google provide Plex for android TV boxes without this
putting them in a difficult position with Studios and Record companies?

Thanks
DessieB

 

Originally by Eddie-M (Official NowTV Team)

 

Hi @Anonymous User

This would come down to legal notices Now TV have received and therefore have had to remove the
fuction due to some Customers using Plex to watch Pirated Content. So the Dev Mode has been
disabled to prevent Pirated content in the future which in turn has disabled Plex which again can be
used to access Content which can be seen as illegal. This is the steps we found nessecerry to take to
prevent this from happening. If others have not done this then we cannot speak for them we feel this
was the best step to take.


Cheers

 

Originally by DessieB

 

Hi Eddie,

So are you suggesting that Apple, Amazon, Roku and Google have not received similar legal notices, or
that they have received similar notices but have chosen to ignore them?

DessieB

 

Originally by Eddie-M (Official NowTV Team):

 

No at all @Anonymous User


I'm not suggesting anything of the sort. I am telling you what Now TV have received and what we have
done to rectify it if other companies have recieved the same notices then i'm sure they are taking the
Steps nessecerry to rectify that however we at Now TV are not privy to that information and therefore
cannot discuss what other companies intend to do if anything or if they have recieved the same
notices we can only discuss what Now TV have recieved and what we have done to ��x it. At the end of
the day Plex is not an offical app in the App store via the Now TV box therefore Now TV have no
legal obligation to provide that app and therefore can remove any means of accessing it.


Cheers

 

Originally by MattPenfold:

 

Eddie-M wrote:
Hi @Anonymous User


Thanks for raising your concerns to us here on the Community, In relation to what a Now TV agent
has said about Plex being illegal your correct it is not however the content available to use with in
Plex and other Apps like it can be seen as illegal and therefore puts Now TV in a difficult position
with Studios and Record companies and therefore the decision was made to remove the Dev Mode
which enabled the ability to install Plex via Sideloading due to Plex not being available in the Now
TV app store. Also if apps are being used via the Now T v box that are not available in the App store
provided and are installed by other means i.e Sideloading then Now TV have the right to remove
that functionallity if we wish to do so. If your complaint relates to official apps in the app store
available via the Now TV box then please do raise those concerns with us and we will do what we
can can to rectify them. However if it only relates to an app not offically available on the Now TV box
then we cannot do anything further and there would be no legal basis for us to put that function
back as it is against our terms of use. I hope this clears it up for you and if you have any further
questions please do ask away and we will do our best to answer or at least get the answer for you.


Thanks
Eddie
So why was I told Plex is illegal Eddie? You admit is untrue, yet that did not stop your colleagues from
say Plex is illegal software. What do you intend to do about their lack of honesty?

You claim you have the right to remove side-loaded apps, but you failed to offer any evidence you have
that right. Since you offered no evidence I can dismiss your claim you have that rigjt as baseless. You
have a choice. You can either offer that evidence, or accept you lied to me.

 

Originally by MattPenfold: (Post 1 on page 50)

 

Eddie,
You have admitted that Not TV altered my box. The law, in the form of the Computer Misuse Act 1990 is
clear in this regard. Unless you can show Now TV were authorized to access my box and make
alterations NOW TV have committed a criminal offence under Section 35 of that act. It is possible that
Now TV could be considered to have committed an offence under Section 37 , if there was intend to
impair use of the computer . A Section 35 offence carries a maximum sentence of 2 years
imprisonment, and a Section 37 offence carries a maximum of 10 years. Both offences can also carry
an unlimited Ƭne.
So you can only claim that Now TV have not comitted an offence under either Section 35 or 37 if you
can show you had authorisation to access my Now TV box. If you cannot do so, you will be admitting
that NOW TV commited a criminal offence.

 

Originally by WuffleBonk: (Post 2 on page 50)

 

@Anonymous User from NowTV, I think there's an age old addidge here that relates to Digging holes and knowing
when to stop 😄

From what I can see, your just not doing ANYTHING to help here, except making up what looks like
semi plausible explanations and hoping that we'll all buy into it.

I have to tip my hat and give you points for trying though. As myself and my co-conspiritors have
recently discovered, we can actually use the official, authourized apps that ARE in the NowTV store,
and pre installed on the box, INCLUDING YOUR VERY OWN NOWTV APP , to play ANY CONTENT we
want, including pirated content should we so wish, I wonder what the recording industry and
music/movie producers that sent NowTV those cease and desist plex letters would do if they found out
about that fact???

I think you'd be forced to remove your own apps, and every official app from the box, IF what your
trying to spin to us all, is actually true....

 

 

 

 

 

188 REPLIES 188
SeeMoreDigital
Legend 5
Legend 5

You're comment cuts both ways @Anonymous User.

 

Sufficed to say, since the unsupported 'sideloading' feature has been removed from all NOW TV branded devices I will formally request that this 'off-topic' discussion (along with any others) be removed from the forum. 

Anonymous User
Not applicable

@SeeMoreDigital wrote:

You're comment cuts both ways @Anonymous User.

 

Sufficed to say, since the unsupported 'sideloading' feature has been removed from all NOW TV branded devices I will formally request that this 'off-topic' discussion (along with any others) be removed from the forum. 


So you want hide your lack of honesty? Not very honest of you is it? 

I note you have not supported your claim that Now TV had lawful authority to upgrade boxes. Your failure to do so is admission on your part you cannot do so, and you lied when you said you could. You obviously think lying is acceptable behaviour. 

DId you notice how Arti could not answer my question either? It seems no one can. Which is troubling. 

 

SeeMoreDigital
Legend 5
Legend 5

I don't have to justify myself to you or anyone else @Anonymous User.

 

What I have said. And I repeat: -

 

NOW TV have never officially advertised that 'sideloading' was an official feature-set of their NOW TV branded boxes!

 

I also mentioned that there was a post submitted by a NOW TV Team member referencing why the 'developer mode' feature had been removed (the topic of which has been removed)... That's it.

Anonymous User
Not applicable

@SeeMoreDigital wrote:

I don't have to justify myself to you or anyone else @Anonymous User.

 

What I have said. And I repeat: -

 

NOW TV have never officially advertised that 'sideloading' was an official feature-set of their NOW TV branded boxes!

 

I also mentioned that there was a post submitted by a NOW TV Team member referencing why the 'developer mode' feature had been removed (the topic of which has been removed)... That's it.


You do realise that the argument that because some people have used their operating system for piracy they have an unlimited right to change the software on boxes they don't own, has very far reaching consequences.

For instance it would give say Microsoft the right to wipe every windows operating system and replace it with DOS 1.0, after all a lot of piracy and other illegal acts are commited on windows computers but would be very difficult to perform on a DOS based computer.

If you think the argument is stupid then consider this. Courts like setting precedents, it make further cases easy to judge the same way and has the added benefit of looking fair to all.

In this case a precedent has already been set when Sony did the same thing to PS3's. It cost them millions. Now TV are up sh*t creek without a paddle.

Anonymous User
Not applicable

@SeeMoreDigital wrote:

I don't have to justify myself to you or anyone else @Anonymous User.

 

What I have said. And I repeat: -

 

NOW TV have never officially advertised that 'sideloading' was an official feature-set of their NOW TV branded boxes!

 

I also mentioned that there was a post submitted by a NOW TV Team member referencing why the 'developer mode' feature had been removed (the topic of which has been removed)... That's it.


When you make claims that you refuse to support then yes you do have to justify yourself. The burden of proof lies with the person making the claim. It is called the philophipical burden of proof. Had you been to university this is something that you would have learnt. You might want to read Bertrand Russul of the subject. His "teapot" essay would be a good start. 

But since you claim you do not have to support your claims it follows that you accept your claims were untrue. By your own admission you lied to us. 

Anonymous User
Not applicable

@SeeMoreDigital wrote:

@Anonymous User wrote:

For Now TV to alter my box they needed my permission. 


You're living in cloud cuckoo land @Anonymous User,

 

NOW TV don't need your permission to remove a feature that was never officially advertised, officially installed or officially supported.

  


Are you sure the Computer Missue Act 1990 has three parts. In the U.K., it is now a crime to:

 

 1. Access a computer without permission.
 2. Access a computer without permission, hoping to break another law.

 3. Change, break or copy files without permission.

 

So Sky/NowTV accessed my NowTV box without my permission as it was an automatic firmware update which I could not opt out of, and they changed files on the computer that I own aka the NowTV box. Whether they advertised the side loading feature or not is utterly immaterial. They broke the law period.

 

Anonymous User
Not applicable

@Anonymous User wrote:

@SeeMoreDigital wrote:

@Anonymous User wrote:

For Now TV to alter my box they needed my permission. 


You're living in cloud cuckoo land @Anonymous User,

 

NOW TV don't need your permission to remove a feature that was never officially advertised, officially installed or officially supported.

  


Are you sure the Computer Missue Act 1990 has three parts. In the U.K., it is now a crime to:

 

 1. Access a computer without permission.
 2. Access a computer without permission, hoping to break another law.

 3. Change, break or copy files without permission.

 

So Sky/NowTV accessed my NowTV box without my permission as it was an automatic firmware update which I could not opt out of, and they changed files on the computer that I own aka the NowTV box. Whether they advertised the side loading feature or not is utterly immaterial. They broke the law period.

 


And no one from Now TV has been able to state what authority they had. They keep saying why they did it, but the legal authority does not follow from the why. 

At this point I think we can say Now TV broke the law.  At the very least they have a case to answer. 

Anonymous User
Not applicable

@SeeMoreDigital wrote:

@Anonymous User wrote:

If they have nothing to hide they will offer an explanation. 


An explanation was given. That being said, in my opinion whether any of you choose to believe it or not is completely immaterial as 'sideloading' was never an officially advertised, officially installed or officially supported feature!

 

You've all had your fun being able to sideload apps on NOW TV branded devices but now it's over. So I suggest you all buy Roku devices and take your 'sideloading' discussions over to the Roku forum!


@Anonymous User wrote:

If they delete this post I will consider they accept they have no legal authority to update boxes without permission and thus broke the law. 


Sufficed to say, now that the unsupported 'sideloading' feature has been removed from NOW TV branded devices. I will be recommending that any further off-topic discussions relating to sideloading should be removed from the forum.

 

Cheers all


Oh no.... I'm SHOCKED!!!!

 

and I'll be recomendeing that I keep re-posting them just as fast as you and your friends take them down....

 

You do know that your interfearing with the right to free speech here, and by doing what theyv'e done, NowTV are in effect censoring mine and everyone elses right to free speech on this forum.

 

oh and just so save you from embarasing yourself and getting things wrong yet again with incorrect information (Which by the way may I compliment you on, you do seem to very good at it)

 

Censorship can only be employed if there is a credible threat to the well being of the service (EG: beacuse the text insighted a DOS attack or the service for example), or to remove personal details, which may be putting someone's life in danger, or if the content is of an Abusive or racial slurr....

 

and while we all may be getting a little rowdy here, I don't think we fall into any of those categories yet.

 

SeeMoreDigital
Legend 5
Legend 5

All of you (both of you). Read NOW TV's terms and conditions. ie: the ones you accepted before activating your NOW TV branded box!

Anonymous User
Not applicable

 


@SeeMoreDigital wrote:

All of you (both of you). Read NOW TV's terms and conditions. ie: the ones you accepted before activating your NOW TV branded box!


So is that the official explanation? 

Only I have just read through the agreement and could not find anything that would allow Now TV to force updates on customers. Maybe you could be a bit more specific. 

Oh, and the agreement is contained within the T&Cs availbile on this website. So have checked them more than once. I doubt you have read them at all.